Michelle Lynne 0:02
Welcome to design for the creative mind, a podcast for interior designers and creative entrepreneurs to run their business with purpose, efficiency and passion. Because, well, every design is different, the process should remain the same. Prepare yourself for some good conversations with amazing guests, a dash of Jesus and a touch of the woowoo and probably a swear word or two. If you're ready to stop trading your time for money and enjoy your interior design business. You are in the right place. I'm your host, Michelle Lynn.
All right. All right. All right. Well, welcome back to the podcast, everybody. I'm so happy you're here. I have kind of like a friend of a friend who I feel like I've known for a while. Her name is Maureen Wang gay. She is the brand growth strategist behind some of America's most beloved brands, such as L'Oreal Chobani, dove and Lay's. She's the creator of big brand Academy, the product profit lab and start word consulting. This is a consulting firm dedicated to teaching product based entrepreneurs, the sales and marketing strategies that they need to scale with scientific precision so that they can turn their product brands into household names. Maureen's zone of genius is her rare ability to connect with a market and turn real data into brand growth strategies that drive multimillion dollar growth. Her nonprofit organization Taji Foundation supports boys and Kenya to get the education they need to lift their families out of poverty and build generational wealth. That's a mouthful, woman. I'm so glad you're here.
Maureen Mwangi 1:52
I'm so glad you're having me, Michelle. Yes. Excited to be here to talk about my story.
Michelle Lynne 1:58
Oh, my gosh, absolutely. And I think that our audience is really going to connect with it. But I want to circle back and clarify, because they're probably thinking, why are we having a product brand strategist, when we don't sell product? Just hold on audience, we will get there because I think that there's so much crossover and so much that we can learn that we're just going to dig right in, because I think there's gonna be a lot of content today. So, Maureen, you come you come from Kenya? Yes. And I think that is amazing that you're giving back to the boys in Kenya, because it's all pay it forward. And that just gives me goosebumps. We're on the radio, so you can actually see it or on the podcast, but I got goosebumps on my apps. So I understand that your parents were entrepreneurs in Kenya, which I believe it's pretty rare, isn't it? Yes, yes. Yes. Yes. What impact did they have on your entrepreneurial journey? Because I think that would be really cool to have grown up in the environment. I
Maureen Mwangi 2:55
would say the biggest impact my parents have had revolves around the non tangible benefits of entrepreneurship like perseverance, greed, patience, confidence, because many people get into entrepreneurship for the money, but they actually don't understand what it takes to build a successful business. And really, what what are the underlying qualities that you need to have as an entrepreneur, but seeing my parents go through the process of trying to build a very successful business in an economy that's also not thriving, taught me so much. And one of the biggest lessons I learned from my parents is grit. I usually say I not the most, I don't have a passion like I'm not good at piano. I'm not good in guitar. But one thing that somebody cannot outdo me on is great.
Michelle Lynne 3:46
I love that my my mom jokes that she said that, the worst thing she did to my brother and I raising us was giving us a good work ethic. Because we both we love to work. And it's like, that's not a bad thing, but it can be. But in entrepreneurialship holy cow, I don't know if I would have had the balls to go into business for myself if I had known what, what it took. So you went in with your eyes wide open. So yeah, grit for sure. And resilience
Maureen Mwangi 4:14
and resilience, because that's the name of the game in entrepreneurship. Yeah,
Michelle Lynne 4:21
I I think that that is something that you have to it's a muscle you have to exercise on a regular basis and and realize that you fail, but you can fail forward. Yes. So you learn from them, perseverance, grit, just the the ongoing, facing forward and knowing that you're going to work hard. Was there any other lessons that came from growing with them
Maureen Mwangi 4:43
definitely add on to the power of branding and marketing. Because the biggest the biggest challenge my parents had was how to really brand and market their product, because the business is the nominee must do Home Depot or Lowe's in the US. So think about that entire an organized Asian, that's what they have in Kenya. And at that time, at that point in time, there was a huge surge of counterfeit products from China in Kenya. Oh, so So literally anybody could go and make the exact same product you're selling and sell it at a much cheaper price. But the only thing that would get you to stand out is through branding and marketing.
Michelle Lynne 5:21
Interesting, very interesting. And so that was, that was a start for you. That
Maureen Mwangi 5:27
was a start for me. So when it constantly could hear my dad talking about the challenges of branding and marketing, I was like, What's so hard about this, I need to figure it out. And so that made me move over to the US. And then I did a Master's in Business Analytics, which is marketing analytics, and then got me the opportunity to work at Nielsen. So I did a lot of data analytics with the Nielsen ratings company, then I moved over to the other big brands.
Michelle Lynne 5:52
Interesting. Okay, so So that leads me into the next thing, when you're talking about all of the data, the data analytics, I think that you say it's important for product based entrepreneurs to know their numbers. So what can what can you say about that? Kind of segwaying? And from the data analytics and whatnot,
Maureen Mwangi 6:11
I think it's important for every entrepreneur to know their numbers, because pretty much no, yes, is the backbone and the engine of your business? Yes,
Michelle Lynne 6:20
I think that that is one of my old bosses taught me. Anytime you need to make a decision, the numbers will tell you, like, the numbers will tell you can you can you can you advertise? Can you spend money on hiring somebody else? Like, know your numbers? And you don't have to be an accountant to do that? No, you
Maureen Mwangi 6:38
don't. But the thing is, there's a fear amongst entrepreneurs that comes in when you're thinking about looking at your numbers, a lot of people say it makes them less creative. It makes them less empowered. But I personally believe that the numbers will empower you to make a strategic decision that will empower you to scale
Michelle Lynne 6:57
will empower you to stay in business. Yes. In some instances. Speaking from experience, it's like oh, shit, I better figure that out and actually do some analysis and not just run by the seat of my pants, which I've been known to do a lot. Y'all, this podcast episode was made possible in part by foyer, a lightning fast interior design software that creates photorealistic renderings. I'm not kidding, you can barely tell that it's not a real room. So why leave your beautiful designs up to the imagination of your client, when you can show them what their space is going to look like. You will sign more clients and get more approvals with the software. It's powered by artificial intelligence, and a whole vouch for its ease. Because if I can do it, anybody can. Because y'all know that my design team are the ones who do all the work, find them in the show notes. So I love that. I absolutely love that. And I think that there's all sorts of numbers. It's not just your financials. But it can be. I mean, for interior design, it's, it's going to be your financials. But it's also going to be what margin are you making with your furniture sales? You know, how many hours are you actually working? If you're charging a lump sum fee, a value based fee? Are you? Are you covering your overhead? Because it's not just your salary? There's all sorts of other overhead that goes with it. So knowing some of that, no, how did you learn it?
Maureen Mwangi 8:25
How did I learn it? I through salary school? Yeah, that was through school. And it's interesting, you talked about value based pricing for interior designers, because that's the same thing I teach in the product space. Because a lot of times as product entrepreneurs, we just focus on the product, but we don't think about the labor involved. To put that together, you don't think about the overhead, once you have your cost of making your product, you need to have some profit, you need to think about value that you're offering. And then that value is your profit.
Michelle Lynne 8:54
And that is value. So for interior designers, a lot of the things that we inherently don't understand is the value that we bring with the natural talent that so many of us have. And so I teach that like until I'm blue in the face. And it's also it's not you, it's not you, that's the value. It's the service you provide. So you can't feel like you're not worth it. Or I guess you can let me rephrase that. A lot of people do feel that they're not worth it. But once we work through a lot of that and get some of those money stories out of their head, it's really the service that you're providing. For you. It's the product, but the product solves a problem. Like duck win.
Maureen Mwangi 9:39
Exactly. And it's so good. You say this because I hire interior designers to design my house, right? And we've also talked about this. And as a customer, I usually just think what's the cost of me doing this on my own? Yeah. It would cost me so much time I'll do the wrong thing. I wouldn't have the right measurement. And I'll probably put the wrong colors. So when you guys give me your fee, that's what I'm paying for. Right? For that less stress
Michelle Lynne 10:09
the solutions. Yes, exactly. And I think that that carries over. So for those of you who are wondering why in the hell are we talking to a product brand strategist? This is why it's because it carries over. It's the same value. It's just a different product. Yeah, service.
Maureen Mwangi 10:24
Yes. Also, as a designer, it goes back to what I always focus on with my students, you have to know that one person you're serving that ideal customer, your champion, your Olympian, you have to know them in and out what they're struggling with, and why they'll buy your service.
Michelle Lynne 10:41
Woman, you are speaking my language. Yes, that is one of the first exercises we do in the interior design business bakery. Because if you don't know who the hell you're serving, then you're serving everybody, and then you're serving nobody. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Because I'm sure you guys go do a ton of market research to figure out. Okay, so who actually uses dub? Who, who eats Chobani? Like, how can we look at the competition and see their data as well? Yeah.
Maureen Mwangi 11:08
And it's not where like for interior designers, it's not where leave? It's what's my psychographic? Like how am I thinking about things? Right? Why would I hire a designer? I value my time a lot more. Yeah, I like my space.
Michelle Lynne 11:22
Yes. And you go home and you feel like you're in a hug? Like, how do you put a price on? Like, that's what we create, we create piece, we create a retreat, we create tranquillity, organization, it's like you walk in, and it's a hug. How do you put money on that? Yeah, but it's the same thing. And I keep going back to dub and I'm thinking I just worked out, I got stinky pits, right? So how do you put a price on, you know, the cleanliness, the good smell? Because if I wouldn't have to be somewhere, then that they would be my solution. And I actually do use that for sensitive skin. Okay, so I think you teach the three phases of a product based businesses lifecycle life, lifecycle, emerging growth and scaling. So what would you say are the most important marketing and sales strategies needed for each phase. And so just to repeat, emerging brand, growth, and scaling?
Maureen Mwangi 12:19
So emerging is you have an idea, right? We're talking to interior designers, you have an idea of becoming an interior designer, well, then when you in that I do phase, you want to do so many things. There's so much information out there, you want to create a website, you want to launch this, you want to run this ad, you want to do so many things. But in that stage, the only thing you need to focus on is do what Michelle tells you identify your ideal client audience, identify your brand, and start selling your service. However you can, when you're wonky mentioned, do interviews, do networking events. And interior designer, this is what I do the same thing for product based businesses don't build a website, when you don't know where your audience is, when you don't know how your product sells, like go out to the events, the pop up shops, the trade shows and sell. That's all you need to focus on. Because at that stage, you're trying to validate your concept. It tried to have a proof of concept. Yes,
Michelle Lynne 13:18
yes, yes, yes. And I've known so many designers who go out and they create a brand and they do a website, they get a logo and bla bla bla, and then they open their doors. And it's just like, girl, you don't even know what services you're going to be offering.
Maureen Mwangi 13:32
Sadly, your pricing probably might not be right. So you start off at a deficit, and then you're trying to pay off everything you've invested. And then you get into this cycle of maybe this was not meant for me, maybe I need to be doing something else. And it's probably just started the wrong way.
Michelle Lynne 13:47
Right, right proof of concept. I think that is that is genius. Just get out there and make sure that people are going to hire you. Exactly. Okay. So that is the emerging
Maureen Mwangi 13:57
then the growth stages, the stage where you've sold your products, you making some consistency rules, in this case, you've sold your services, you're starting to ask yourself, Is this actually a business? If that's the question you're asking yourself, then you're in the growth stage. And now what you need to do is start looking at your numbers, like what service has been doing well, what product has been selling? Well look at your marketing activities, what have you been doing which channel is driving the most traffic for you? Because this is where I want you to start honing in on what works. It's not. It's not the stage to start adding very many things. It's the stage to be laser focused. Because when you laser focus in this stage, it's easy for you to get to the scaling stage because you're just going to duplicate and amplify what you were doing before in the scaling stage.
Michelle Lynne 14:47
So basically what you're saying is instead of throwing spaghetti against the wall and advertising in three magazine, paying SEO for your website, getting all over social media, start small. Yes. And then figure out what works and keep improving that. And then you can add little by little. So
Maureen Mwangi 15:08
at least expensive. Exactly, because even at that stage, your primary focus as a CEO is customer acquisition. Mm hmm. And you have to know you have to go and acquire customers in the channels that are already working, not in something that's not working, you're wasting time.
Michelle Lynne 15:23
Exactly. And I'm a big fan of not recreating the wheel. Because if you know something that works, why, why do you have to be different? Like, I don't like to be the same. But I do like to make money. I do like to have clients, you know, calling me. So I love that. Because we're, I mean, especially as interior designers, we're like shiny object. Like, that's pretty, that's pretty, let's do that. Let's do that. And it is I, I've been guilty of that early in my early in my career as well. Okay, so once it grows, then you're going to work on scaling it, you're going
Maureen Mwangi 15:59
to work on scaling. Now in scaling, this is where this is what I usually say scaling, most of the growth is going to come outside of yourself. If you've constantly be doing the same thing over and over again, you're going to get the same result. So here is where you need vision and strategy. So you now need to sit down and ask yourself, Where does my business need to be three years from today, five years from today, and then work backwards to achieve that. If it means adding a new line extension or a new service, this is your stage, if it means now hiring internally, right. So if you were doing all the marketing, hire somebody to help you with the marketing inside now, right? Because to free up your time to be the CEO, the visionary to create a roadmap for growth.
Michelle Lynne 16:45
And that's where you outsource. So first of all, accounting should be outsourced as soon as you start making a nickel. So like we're not accountants, y'all. And that's not something to mess around with. But like you said, social media, outsource your blog posts, there's all sorts of things that we can outsource procurement, and then hiring Tanya, I need you to podcast on how to hire and how to grow. But until then, I think it's so important that you do not be the solopreneur your entire life. Because if that's the case, then you can never take a vacation, you can never get sick, you can never just turn the phone off. But if you can bring other individuals on to give you a hand, not only does that increase your revenue, because you can increase your workload. But you also I'll tell you, this is a lonely industry. I don't and you just get more creativity from other individuals and you're bouncing ideas off of each other. And it's so much fun. And there's you don't lose control if you communicate. And so scaling has just been such a game changer for me. Like Debbie and Megan. They do all the work. They do all the work. I worked myself out of a job I just didn't. I don't love those details as much anymore. They do. So sweet. Now we're here on the podcast for design for the creative mind because of that, that would they're the ones who allowed this to happen. Love, love, love it. Let me interrupt myself to take a quick moment to thank satin off Insurance Agency for sponsoring this episode of The designed for the creative mind podcast. Their support and understanding of the interior design, decorating and home staging industries is unrivaled. Satin off understands what our businesses do. And they provide insurance that lets me sleep at night. Yep, this is the firm that I use. And they will do the same for your sleep habits and your business too. They're more than an insurance agency. They're an extension of my business. They take care of the worry, because they are the experts, which allows me and my team breathing room to do what we do best design beautiful spaces. You can find their contact information below in the show notes. Give him a call today. Let's see what else big brands strategies. That's what you teach entrepreneurs. What do Okay, so what a big brands know, that little baby growing back brands don't know. And maybe not even little baby. But what? What a big brands now, the power
Maureen Mwangi 19:12
of personalization and humanization? Oh, yes. So over the last two, three years, there's been this huge push of humanizing the products. If you even look at the marketing strategies that big brands are using, you will notice that they're personifying the product, you will notice they're using a lot of emotional touch points when they're communicating, because that is what draws consumers consumer behavior now shows that with technology becoming so rampant, people felt disconnected and detached. So people now want more personalization. People want to feel like they're being seen and heard. But in the small business space, we want To be, we don't want to do any of that. We don't want to offer good customer service. We don't want to market our own products and services. We want somebody else to do it for us. But big brands have a huge marketing budget, but that's why they pay influencers, the human beings to personify the brand.
Michelle Lynne 20:18
Oh, that is totally full circle. Yes. The Influencers do that. Exactly.
Maureen Mwangi 20:23
why small businesses, we need to continue doing that, because that's what people are buying.
Michelle Lynne 20:31
Yes. And it's funny. I joke about this in my in my program, it's like BYOB. Bring your own booze. It's Be your own brand. Yeah. And what so one of the things that I've seen a lot of is like stories, yes. Like, there's a lot of stories that are told within a brand. And it's about the way that makes you feel.
Maureen Mwangi 20:53
Yes. And this is this is a tagline that I always use. Branding is why people buy you marketing is how people find you.
Michelle Lynne 21:00
That's a good one. So that again,
Maureen Mwangi 21:02
please brand branding is why people buy you, marketing is how people find you.
Michelle Lynne 21:11
It's like a total total nugget of wisdom. I love that. And so if you want
Maureen Mwangi 21:16
to ramp up your sales, if you want to ramp up your book, consultations, it's the why it's the storytelling, it's the connection. Who are you outside of the mood board? Who are you outside of the color schemes? Who are you outside of the beautiful room that you put together?
Michelle Lynne 21:36
And that's so true, because it's like, I am a firm believer in community over competition like that is my as many people as I can lift is my goal. And even when I was when I first started the interior design business bakery, you know, there were some local designers that I'm friends with, and they're like, what you're teaching them everything, you're giving them your pricing, you're giving them all of that and like Yeah, absolutely, because people are gonna buy me and my team because they like us. You know, I don't care if you know, the girl next door has the exact same pricing, she's got a different personality. So I love I love hearing that. That's part of big brands, too. It's a strategy now and, and it's not hard. Just be yourself. Yourself bed. Love it. Love, love. Love it. Okay, so I don't know if you know this. I love talking all things business. Okay, but I'd also like to have a little bit of fun. So this next segment, because I could talk business with you until I'm blue in the face. In fact, we're gonna get off camera, we're gonna keep talking and maybe go have drinks. Because yes, Maureen is actually here in the Dallas Fort Worth area. So yeah, like you need. So this next segment is a rapid fire q&a format. And it is just so the audience can get to know you. And nothing's off the table. Okay, so we'll start off. We'll start off easy. Are you left handed or right handed?
Maureen Mwangi 22:58
Right.
Michelle Lynne 22:59
Last movie you watched?
Maureen Mwangi 23:01
How the man who built America? Oh,
Michelle Lynne 23:04
that sounds good. Chocolate chip or oatmeal cookie? Oatmeal Cookie. When was the last time you laughed until you nearly peed yourself? Right
Maureen Mwangi 23:13
before this podcast with you?
Michelle Lynne 23:22
I know it's not funny. It's like you just meet people. And it's like, okay, we go way back. Beach or mountains. Bitch. Who's your favorite superhero?
Maureen Mwangi 23:31
Is Oprah superhero Oprah.
Michelle Lynne 23:33
I think so. We'll give her a cape. She's the queen. Red or white wine. Red dog or cat.
Maureen Mwangi 23:43
Nan.
Michelle Lynne 23:44
And what is your favorite form of exercise?
Maureen Mwangi 23:46
CrossFit?
Michelle Lynne 23:47
Yep. Which is where you're headed here soon. I know. What genre of music do you listen to? r&b? Oh, fun, fun fun. Okay, if you could have dinner with anybody who is the one person that you would invite Michelle Obama. Oh, I have her book. I need to read that. Amazing. Okay. And if you could do anything other than what you're doing now for living, what would it be? Interior Design? Oh, really? Yeah. What was the last time you took a nap Maureen?
Maureen Mwangi 24:21
yesterday?
Michelle Lynne 24:25
Did and would you say you're an introvert or an extrovert? Introvert. Me too. Usually surprises people, especially with as much fun as we have on the conversation, but it's much easier one to one. All right. So thank you for being here. Is there any last words you'd like to leave with the audience? Or I will just point them to how they find you. Actually Tell me how can we how can they find you?
Maureen Mwangi 24:49
They can find me on my instagram at Marine Mangie MW ngi official or they can go to my website WWE dot Stadtwerke consulting.com
Michelle Lynne 24:59
How Perfect. And that is all going to be in our show notes, y'all. So if you're driving or if you just want to refer back to it later, please go and show Maureen some love telling you heard her here. And in the meantime, for those of you who can benefit from even more resources surrounding your business, whether it's the business of interior design, or if it is just a creative, join the growing community on my Facebook private group, the interior design business Launchpad, and for some reason, I'm having a really hard time getting this out of my mouth. Come join me, Facebook, we do free live training once a week, interior design business Launchpad. And don't forget to leave a review wherever you're catching this podcast. So thank you, marine for being here. This was so much fun.
Maureen Mwangi 25:45
Thank you for having me. Michelle loves this session.
Michelle Lynne 25:47
It has been my absolute pleasure. Hey, y'all, if you love the show and find it useful, I would really appreciate it if you would share with your friends and followers. And if you like what you're hearing, want to put a face with a name and get even more business advice. Then join me in my Facebook group. The interior designers business Launchpad. Yeah, I know it's Facebook, but just come on in for the training and then leave without scrolling your feet. It's fine. I promise you'll enjoy it. And finally, I hear it's good for business to get ratings on your podcast. So please drop yours on whatever platform you use to listen to this. We're all about community over competition. So let's work on elevating our industry, one designer at a time. See you next time.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
