Michelle Lynne 0:00
Music. Welcome to design for the creative mind, a podcast for interior designers and creative entrepreneurs to run their business with purpose, efficiency and passion, because while every design is different, the process should remain the same. Prepare yourself for some good conversations with amazing guests, a dash of Jesus and a touch of the Woo, woo, and probably a swear word or two. If you're ready to stop trading your time for money and enjoy your interior design business, you are in the right place. I'm your host. Michelle Lynn, you
Michelle Lynne 0:49
Hey, y'all, welcome back to design for the creative mind. This is a solo episode, and it is in response to a question that I received on Instagram. So I'd really like to encourage any of y'all, if you have questions that you would like to have addressed on the podcast, I'd love this. I would love for this to become a regular occurrence on the podcast, actually addressing specific questions that the audience has. Because y'all, if you have a question in your mind, I'll bet you $99 that 99 other people have the same question. So Louis Johnston, design out of Ireland, actually responded to a reel that I did. It was a rookie mistake number three, and I believe it had to be charging hourly, or charging not not charging for a flat fee, something along that line. Her response to that reel was this, I love listening to your podcast. I've created a group of 20 interior designers here in Ireland, and this topic is something we're all struggling with. Many of us have reverted to charging hourly because clients tend to run wild with our time on flat fees. Do you have any guidance on how to set the boundaries with the flat fee approach? So Louise, thank you so much for reaching out. I'm sorry it has taken me October. Oh, it's only been a couple weeks.
Michelle Lynne 2:13
Okay, it's it's taken me a couple weeks to get this recorded, and I hope to have it published here pretty quickly as well. I've made some quick notes. This is not all inclusive, but here are the key factors in regards to kind of controlling your clients. First of all, it has to do with the sales process. If you've ever attended a rolling in the dough workshop that I've hosted, you know that there's multiple steps, and most of it is educational on the part of to to the client. If you have not attended a rolling in the dough, keep your eyes open, because I have a workshop coming up in December, and the workshop is how to qualify quote and close badass clients or amazing clients while you are baking your profits into the project. But let me just go over this briefly. In the sales process, it's not just the clients interviewing you, but it's also you interviewing the clients. And while you are interviewing them, your process is to educate them on how you work, which includes how you charge your fees. It starts with a quick qualifying call. We call it a qualifying call internally, externally. I probably have it on my website as a discovery call. But what you're wanting to do is you want to qualify their overall investment in their time frame. If those two are both reasonable based on what they're describing that their needs to you, then you move them to the next phase, which is a meet and greet. You can do it in person, but not at their house. You can do it in person at your studio or at a showroom, or you can do it virtually about 45 minutes to an hour. And basically what you're doing at that point is you're sharing with them how you operate and why it benefits them. We at ml interiors group, actually, and what I teach in the interior design business, bakery and on my other mentorship programs is we share an actual graphic of the fees that they can anticipate. It's my design fee.
Michelle Lynne 4:14
And I tell them it's a flat fee based on the square footage and the layers of complexity that go into the project, and then we share with them, and then you have your purchases, and then you have your receiver, and then you're going to have your contractor, or whatever work rooms we're working with in in relation to your project. So I tell them that it's a flat fee, so we're sharing with them at that point that we're not working hourly. A lot of what we're doing as well is we are setting our boundaries and setting the precedent that we're in charge. So you're sharing with them how you work and why it benefits them in the meet and greet if everything goes smoothly and you ask them. So if this sounds like the way you would want to have your project handled, our. Next step is, and that's going to be your initial visit, and then the preparation and presentation of your scope of work and the signing of the contract. As you're running through this entire sales process, you are establishing credibility and trust. You're setting yourself up as a professional. And what it does is it's going to give you, you're going to it's going to give your clients the perception that you're not to be messed with, okay, or that they can't push you around as much. And is this the magic trick? No, but it gives you this level of professionalism that they don't question you as much.
Michelle Lynne 5:41
Now, in your scope of work, you're going to outline anything and everything that you're delivering. Your scope of work should be a long document, if it's a big project, and it should still be incredibly detailed, even if it's just a single room. But folks, here's the kicker, and that is that if it's not on the scope of work, you're not going to you're not going to do whatever they're asking. So for example, what's happened to us? And I'm not sure if this is what happens to Louise and her people, which, by the way, I'm so excited that you get that many people together, because community over competition is everything. So hats off to y'all in Ireland. Back to the scope of work. Let's just say you are on site, and you are walking through and giving them a preview of the design vision, and you're at their house, and they say to you, well, while you're here, can you take a look at this room and give me some ideas? Okay, so they're taking you off of the number of hours that you're focused on for your flat fee. But the response can be, I'd love to take a look at that. Would you like me to create another scope of work that will either increase your project size or it'll get rid of their additional inquiries immediately, once you have your scope of work completed and agreed to and they're about to sign the contract, then in your contract, this is a way to build some protection in for you as well, and sometimes your contract can provide The boundaries that you don't necessarily feel comfortable enforcing, because you don't want to feel like the bad guy. You can make your contract the bad guy, or your agreement we ours, is called a letter of agreement. But so if you prepare, if you present it to them, it's like, here's our letter of agreement.
Michelle Lynne 7:35
This is what we agree to do. This is what you agree to do. It's friendly, it's easy to address and so forth. Some some key clauses that you want to have in there is that you do that you provide them. And this is how we work. Okay, everybody's going to be a little bit different, but what we share with them is that we're going to share with you the one best choice for every item. I'm not giving them two or three, I'm giving them the one best choice that matches their timeline, their budget, their style and the quality required. So they understand that it's like it that the What else is there? What else is there? What else is there? I'm not your personal shopper, and as I'm going through and they're signing the contract, I'm explaining some of these very unique clauses to the client so they understand that. Because what I can also do is I can refer back later, when I do deliver the final design presentation, and they're like, Well, what else is there for that dining table, or whatever the case may be, I can refer back to and remind them, hey, do you remember in the letter of agreement? I don't give multiple options, because this is the best selection based on your timeline, based on your budget, based on your style, based on the quality it needs to be. From there, if they want to do revisions, we build that into the contract as well.
Michelle Lynne 9:01
The revisions, depending on the project, it might be one re select per room. I'm not going to revise the entire room like you get one re selection per room. So you want a different pillow fabric, great. You get a different pillow fabric. You want a different paint color? Great. You get a different paint color. After that, there's change order fees. So if you're going to change something, I also advise them on the fact that what we've done is when we've made these selections, and one of the reasons they only get one is because there is that design domino effect. You all know what I'm talking about. Okay, so you want to change the size of the rug, you actually want it bigger? Well, if you want it bigger, it's going to increase the amount of spend. And you said you didn't want to spend anything more than this for your rug and your overall investment. Well, then what it's also going to do is, when you get a larger rug, it's going to change the side tables that are next to the sofa, and it's going to be either the front foot on and the front foot back. So it's going to be. Little bit wobbly, so we need to get a much larger table and and it is that design Domino. So you you explain that to them, because what I have learned is that clients are generally not jerks. They just don't understand a lot of what we take for granted. Imagine trying to bake a cake without a recipe. You kind of know what the ingredients are, but you don't know how to put it all together.
Michelle Lynne 10:30
After lots of hard work and trying different combinations, all you are left with is a sticky situation and a stomach ache. Babe running an interior design business can feel exactly that same way. That is why I created the interior design business bakery. This is a program that teaches you how to bake your interior design business cake and eat it too. If you don't want to figure out the hard way and you want guidance to follow a recipe that has already been vetted, someone that has already been there and done it, and will help you do it too. Then check out the year long mentorship and coaching program the interior design business bakery, if your interior design business revenue is below 300,000 or if you're struggling to make a profit and keep your sanity. This is the only program for you. You can find that information at designed for the creative mind.com. Forward slash, business. Dash, bakery, check it out. You won't regret it.
Michelle Lynne 11:36
You and so when you explain some of these nuances to them, they're not going to be coming back trying to push your boundaries. Now, there will be clients that just want to push the boundaries because that's their their personality, but for the most part, when clients understand that you don't have these rules just to be a jerk, that there are consequences to making changes, or the reason why you're only bringing them one selection then, then they're more likely to agree to it and be on board with it. Another area where we have had people try to run away with our time that we've put into our contract or into our agreement is visits. And this is a true story. I firmly believe that it was just there was a season where I was working, and this was before we grew substantially at ml interior group, but there was a season where I would get calls from they were stay at home moms, y'all, they were all stay at home moms, my clients were or at home with their kids, or they were at home while their kids were at school. And they would call and say, Can you come over and look at this crowd? It looks a little bit too dark of a gray. And y'all, I think they were just bored. I think they were bored and they wanted some some adult interaction. And now it's just like, take a picture and send it to me.
Michelle Lynne 13:02
No, I want you to come over. Well, now what we have in our con, in our agreement, is how many visits they can instigate, like you can, you can ask me to come over twice for no charge, just to just to walk through, just to see something, or whatever the case may be, but and I'll go, I'll go to the project side, as you know, once a week if I need two, three times a week, whatever that looks like. But don't call me over for these stupid things. That is just a total time suck. So what we have in our agreement is you are allotted X number of visits by request, and after that, the price goes up two per visit. And it's the it's the same thing with revisions, you have to put a consequence that's going to make them stop and think so if you want another re select, it's going to be X number of dollars, and it needs to be an X number of dollars. That's going to make them pause to say, Oh, well, that's a great table. Do I really need to see more? And so it has. They have skin in the game, and it makes it worth your while. So just make sure that if you are char, you're not charging by the hour. But what you're going to do is you're going to say a visit is going to be $400 an hour, portal to portal, because what you're doing is you're taking time out of other clients, projects or other business development tasks and measures that you should be doing.
Michelle Lynne 14:28
So it needs to be worth your while to drop everything that you're doing, to run over to their project if they're asking or if they're wanting, reselects and what the case may be, so that, I think, is a lot of the key aspects in our agreement, just make sure those are written in another thing that we've actually just implemented over the past year is pre scheduling our meetings. Therefore, what we have are we have some key meetings with our clients. It's going to be for trade day. It's going to be. For the design concept presentation. It's going to be for the we call it, kind of like this or that, like helping them make decisions and move things forward, and then it's the the pre design meeting, and then the final design meeting. So there's a variety of these that we put on the calendar when they're signing the contract. This allows us in conversations. If they're hemming and hawing or they're trying, they're just like pulling time out of the day that they they feel, that they need. And I'm not really sure, Louise what, how your clients were running wild with your time, but if they're asking for this, you can remind them, hey, we've got a meeting in two weeks, we're going to address that then. Or, hey, we have a meeting in two weeks, we need to make these decisions and and it just continues to move that needle forward.
Michelle Lynne 15:50
Because if it's not on the calendar, not not just your client, are they? Are they going to be saying, Okay, well, we've got plenty of time, but you're also going to think that you have plenty of time, but when you back yourself into a timeline, you're much more apt to meet those deadlines. And then it reminds your clients that you are continuing to meet those deadlines for them. So hopefully that makes sense. And then finally, one of the things that has been very helpful for us, and it goes in tandem with those pre scheduled meetings is make sure you put an end date on your contract. Put an end date on your contract for a couple of reasons. One, because you can tell your client, Hey, babe, your contract is coming to an end in a month and a half. We this is what we've already done, or we need to keep things moving forward, or whatever the case may be. In all reality, when we've had clients that we've had to renew their contract, they don't necessarily know that the price isn't going to go up. Because when I'm explaining when they sign the contract, and we're walking through all of those, those caveats, those nuances, those clauses that are specific to the interior design industry, I also tell them, I anticipate this project is going to take us nine to 12 months. So I have 13 months allotted for your contract. If they are taking their sweet ass time and they aren't making decisions, they're they're eating up our time and so forth. Well, when I present that to him, I say, I put this end date on there, because at which point we may need to review and revise if the project hasn't moved forward the way we anticipate it, because our fees go up on a regular basis. Our fees increase over time, you know, based with the economy and inflation and all of that sort of stuff. So they know that their price may be going up.
Michelle Lynne 17:40
So those are some of the ways that we put, almost like a defensive mode out in regards to where they can become time time, vamper vampires. But another thing that you can do is, are you collecting data? You need to be collecting as much data as you can based on the fees that you're charging to ensure that you're being efficient, that you are giving yourself enough time in those flat fees. Just because it's a flat fee doesn't mean it's correct. It could be a different type of project, but keep your time tracking in the background so that you know, okay, I allotted for the equivalent of, I don't know, 57 hours for this particular space downstairs, and it actually took me 65 and it wasn't because they were being a time suck. It's just because it took longer than I anticipated. So you keep that information on hand. So the next time you're starting to bid out a project, you're building some buffer into your flat fees. All right, Louise and friends over in Ireland, let me know. I'd love to just grab, you, know, drop a note in the DMS, or drop a note in the comments here on the podcast. Let me know if that's that's that that addresses some of what you've been struggling with, and if not, then we will just continue the conversation. And for those of you who are listening, who have questions that have come up, if I can, if I can devote an entire podcast to your dilemma, I will do so, but if not, then I'll collect a handful of smaller questions, and we'll just have a what would Michelle do type of the podcast and address any sort of these questions? And I'm happy to do so I love this. So please shoot me your inquiries.
Michelle Lynne 19:33
You can send it to podcast at, designed for the creative mind. You can DM me at, designed for the creative mind, whatever that looks like. Please don't hesitate to to reach out. I love hearing from you guys. So with that, the last thing I'm going to mention is, if you want a I'm going to just joke about this being a business bestie who sends business tips, encouraging words, event up. Dates and so forth directly to your fingertips. Please type the word bestie or text the word bestie to 855-784-8299, and you'll hear from me on the regular, no spam, no spam. It's a lot of fun. In fact, I ran into somebody at High Point this week that came up and truly said, Thank you so much for all of the encouragement that you send via text. I was like, Oh, that's so awesome. I'm glad it's not just my mom on the text message receiving. So again, text the word bestie, the 8557848, 8299, and we'll stay in touch. And until then, choose to be great today and every day. Thanks for listening. Hey, y'all, if you love the show and find it useful, I would really appreciate it if you would share with your friends and followers, and if you like what you hearing. Want to put a face with a name and get even more business advice, then join me in my Facebook group, the interior designers business launch pad. Yeah, yeah, I know it's Facebook, but just come on in for the training and then leave without scrolling your feet. It's fun. I promise you'll enjoy it. And finally, I hear it's good for business to get ratings on your podcast, so please drop yours on whatever platform you use to listen to this. We're all about community over competition, so let's work on elevating our industry one designer at a time. See you next time you.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
